"Sephiroth." The tone perfectly manages the inflection of 'not the point'. He lets out a heavy sigh and shakes his head. Yeah, the kid really was like his parents. Hell, even like Vincent's dad, probably.
Moving on though is a mixed blessing. Again the former Turk shakes his head before explaining. "Chaos merging with me was an unintended side-effect... consequence of what was done to make sure I survived." Or so it was mentioned in notes found, for all she expressed her sorrow and apologized so, so many times in visions, dreams and nightmares. Though that's not all she was apologizing for.
Nothing worked out the way it was intended.
"She used a... naturally occurring element, something created by the Lifestream like mako or materia. Dark and chaotic in nature, it is... what Chaos was born from." There is a short pause. "...It was used in the birth of Nero the Sable, too."
Yet another shake of his head. "I've only been able to piece together what was done to me from data I found. And traces Lucrecia left behind as messages. Hojo was probably right when he claimed his experiments made my body unable to age or die. The mention of degeneration..." Vincent shrugs. How that fits in with 'not aging or dying' is certainly unclear. Those details are vague.
"...I wasn't always conscious during the procedures or in between. But... probably because of that, I was able to hold on. Whatever Lucrecia did in the end before she disappeared stabilized me. But opened the way for Chaos."
Sephiroth probably understands very well why Vincent is glossing over the details he does remember of the procedures. 'Not always conscious' does mean there were times he was and probably felt every bit of the disorientation and pain already implied.
"That doesn't answer the question. If Chaos was sustaining you, how are you still alive without it?"
This doesn't make the rest of it irrelevant. He knows what being under the care of Hojo meant, as profoundly as any of the other victims could. The only difference was Hojo's vested interest in seeing him survive, so there was always a plethora of medical equipment and healing materia onhand to make certain if his unnatural regeneration failed that he still wouldn't die, a luxury not afforded the rest of the samples.
"I can only tell you what I know. Lucrecia used the same element Chaos was birthed from in her work to save me. That invited Chaos, but that doesn't mean it was intended to be part of the solution."
Just that... the way was opened for Vincent to host it.
"There's also what Hojo did. While he didn't succeed in what his goal was, it still left me with a durable body. The... element, the chaos energy is still present. But Chaos itself wasn't needed to sustain me. And if there's more to it than that... I don't know."
What he does know is that he did a swan dive into Omega, Chaos and Omega returned to the Planet and he... well, he emerged whole again.
Now, Vincent does look a little uncomfortable. It's been tricky to talk about, trickier still to be confronted with the holes in what he still doesn't know about everything that's been done to him. Sure he's discovered little by little, sometimes at the cost of a lot of pain. But it seems like a drop in the bucket in the face of Sephiroth's probing questions.
It's ... not something he's ever going to get an answer to, if Vincent doesn't already know. While he still certainly wanted to, he also was not interested in pursuing it endlessly; in the end it wasn't really important.
"It doesn't matter." Idle curiosity, and little else. "Is a WEAPON capable of killing me in a permanent fashion? I don't recall anyone mentioning they were effective."
"There was never a known encounter between the WEAPONs and Sephiroth. When they appeared, he was hidden under a barrier. Humanity became the primary targets and the combined efforts of Shinra and our group ended their threat. In most circumstances, WEAPONs are nothing more than beasts. A threat to planet was a threat."
It didn't matter if it was Sephiroth's actions that had summoned them forth.
"Chaos was designed to destroy all life and return it to the Lifestream," Vincent responds after a short pause. "If there was a weapon that could kill Sephiroth permanently, it would be the most likely to succeed. But there's no way to be sure."
Without... well, killing Sephiroth outside of Folkmore.
"That does sound like a no." It's quiet, very quiet. A beast wasn't going to be able to stop a trained SOLDIER on par with someone like Cloud. "Pointless, I suppose. Nothing here affects there, in that fashion."
Chaos and Omega, it seemed, were tangents. "I'm sure if it became necessary, people would line up for the chance to subdue a violent and dangerous opponent. Perhaps even Thirteen herself." What did he want out of a bond?
Nothing it could offer. He didn't need a friendly hand, he needed a leash and a muzzle.
When the guard hound makes a reappearance in a slow roil of black smoke, it's close enough to settle at Sephiroth's side, not..quite touching.
"If.. if I go mad here. If I fully become a monster." His gaze turns towards the river, and its glittering banks. "Find out why. Use this link for that. Was it inevitable? Or was I pushed? And if it was forced." Maybe it was inevitable and nothing could be done. Maybe it was his fate all along.
But if not. "A Familiar bond will let you find me. What I want, Mr. Valentine." Only then does he actually look at the red clad Turk, somber. "Is for you to bring me the ones who wronged me. And then leave them to face what they made. No matter who it is."
"Mm. Who knows. Junon's canon was enough to take out one. And modified it took out Diamond WEAPON." ...Hah, 'enough'. Something at point blank or a shot that drained eight mako reactors temporarily to make the shot. Vincent had mentioned at least Diamond WEAPON's fate in his original retelling. The others hadn't been critical; they had not been directly involved other than being released.
Does Sephiroth's power rival a direct shot from either versions of the canon? Could he endure a shot similar to the strength of Sister Ray? ...Let's hope they never have to really find that out. Neither Chaos or Omega alone had any more intelligence than those WEAPONS. It had been their connection and embodiment with the wills of Vincent Valentine and then Weiss and Nero, that had given them any sentience that would be recognized as such. And that probably made the Chaos slumbering in the Vincent of his world a threat. At least, an unknown.
Now that the teen knows, it's no doubt he'll remember if things go wrong. But that is a problem for the future that they're hoping, on some level, to prevent.
What do you want from the bond. Though Vincent had been glancing out at the river, when Sephiroth again finally brings up the potential for future madness, he turns his entire focus on the silver haired youth. The request is not entirely met with surprise. Yet there's a brief hesitation, to think over what those words would mean. Vincent is far from reluctant. However there are a great many factors to consider. Finding the truth of that madness and there are plenty of elements in Folkmore alien to their world that could trigger it.
"I will do everything I can to find out why." Through the bond, though all his skills as a former Turk. And whatever help he can gather from others. There's then a slow nod, though he offers a quiet question.
"If Thirteen is the case. Or if she brings Lucrecia here... Gast or Hojo." Well at least two of those Vincent would have no problem throwing to the silver wolf god. The third.... "Should I bring them as well?"
And... well, if he's bringing them, he'll already be there won't he?
"I don't mean by virtue of my creation, but recent action. My father, certainly. He'll want to see the culmination of all his efforts, after all." And Hojo absolutely would happily help it along if he thought it'd get interesting results, he already knew that. "The difference between putting a gun on a counter, and picking it up and shooting someone."
He was very focused in that particular wish for retaliation. If someone went out of their way to provoke it.. "I don't get the impression even trying to destroy the world that I become any less intelligent, or truly feral. But positive punishment may be an effective deterrent even if I am aware it's what's happening, to at least prevent rampant havoc." Emotional influence could be a powerful thing. If he found pleasure in the kill, souring that joy would make it less appealing.
"Hmph," Vincent answers in regard to bringing Hojo. Either way that will definitely happen. And if Sephiroth doesn't kill him... Well, Vincent won't be put out at all doing it again. But reminder of the teen's father does bring a half-lidded regard of speculation from Vincent. It reminds him of the earlier insinuation about what the young man had experienced during that 'trial'.
"Not that I'm aware." Frankly, Vincent wasn't sure if the arrogance had changed. What Sephiroth had been brought up believing... seeing out of those around him compared to his own power... "I can't make any promises that I'd succeed if it turned out to be Thirteen in the end. But that wouldn't stop me from trying. Anyone else... I'll manage somehow."
The former Turk's eyes are now opened fully. He's studying Sephiroth carefully as he remarks about the use of emotional manipulations. "That.... you want me to use the bond to manipulate your reaction to certain actions?" The question is probably as neutrally spoken as Vincent can manage and yet it's still clear he's not comfortable with the idea.
"That... did Hojo... the scientists, use that on you? That how you learned it?" Very clear.
Until Cloud, nothing's ever really challenged him. He knew he was stronger, faster, more durable than anything anyone could hope to throw at him. It's a precarious balance between utter assurance at his superiority and also being certain he was worthless if he couldn't do the one thing he was made for.
"You won't be able to manage direct control, like I can my eventual puppets. That wouldn't be 'supporting a legend', and presumably is beyond the reach of such a tether." Messing with his emotions was not ideal but could be used to try to curb the worst.
Would he even take pleasure in slaughtering people without any chance of fighting him? Or was it merely the satisfaction an exterminator feels on eradicating a nest of vermin?
The idea that Hojo or the others COULD do such a thing to him earns a blank look. "No, of course not." They did, but through different means than what he's intending here. Enough reinforcement for what they wanted, and he no longer resisted. He hadn't needed to be bound to a table since he was young, no matter what they did. "It's standard procedure for unruly specimens when positive reinforcement fails. I've watched it countless times. SOme species simply don't react to anything else."
So... yes, then, whether or not it was the exact same method. Of course it doesn't surprise him. It hurts that Sephiroth would think nothing of having Vincent use it on him. There is some terrible rationale present given the stakes. It turns the stomach to consider using it on the teenager who's already suffered that and more at the hands of scientists, so much so that he sees nothing different between himself and the specimens in cages still, even months apart from Shinra.
It also hurts because Vincent knows he's probably capable of setting aside the morals and doing it.
"I'm not thrilled that you're asking me to do something that even the scientists at the company or Hojo might not have done," Vincent finally begins. There's a trace of bitterness; but he could be forgiven for not liking it in that context. As to the way the teen devalues his worth as a person and simply implies Vincent should just regard it as standard procedure for an unruly specimen. But he won't bring that up now.
"But... explain further how you want it used. I don't want anything to hinder what you have to do when you return to your time." So far, Sephiroth has only generalized. So the former Turk can't really be blamed for wanting specifics under those conditions.
Dog and boy share a brief look. "You ... offered to do just that a few minutes ago." His tone is slow and cautious, unsure suddenly what the right answer is supposed to be. Was he supposed to interpret the mention of Familiars calming Legend emotions, and exerting influence over them, in some other way?
Was he supposed to refuse, and be insulted at its implication? "Was this a test?" He must have failed it.
There is a short pause. When Vincent's eyes close a moment, there is actually tension. And he brings his left hand, gauntlet and all, to cup his face. Hide it.
"Damn it." ...What? While Vincent doesn't quite drag his hand down his face - for obvious reasons- it's slowly pulled downward and away to drop to his knees again. He exhales to steady himself and turns to face the pair.
"I did. But this wasn't a test. What you just said makes me realize it was no better than how the scientists treated you your entire life." His expression shows muted regret and resignation; probably going a lot deeper.
"Worse, because I know you accept so many things without question because of that abuse. Even if it sounds reasonable, the rational thing to do."
The methods Hojo and his assistants used to gain Sephiroth's unquestioning compliance when he was much, much younger than his already young age almost certainly lined up. Most living things responded well to operant conditioning.
"...It is the reasonable thing to do, or you wouldn't have suggested it to begin with." How much of the objection he really understands is questionable.
But he does know an offer was made, and it was sensible at the time. Still was, even after a review of it. "If it was ... some form of abuse, which I question, a tool is a tool, no matter who's using it before you do. You can't tame a monster with friendship and love." They can however be occasionally beaten into submission!
"I wanted to provide a way to balance the unnatural strength of your emotions caused by the Role Thirteen assigned to you. That... was reasonable," Vincent responds slowly. "...Probably."
Probably, since it was balancing out something that was being forced on Sephiroth. But it had opened a door.
"The part that wasn't right, no matter how it sounds, was to suggest it be used for anything else. To control your emotions or your actions based on those emotions. You've been conditioned to believe that. To think it's normal."
Though... it's true Vincent is unclear if even that would be something that gets through to the teen. So... he proffers a question.
"...If you don't believe me, then... when you were experiencing the Trial in the fog, what stopped you from helping Hojo's victim?
"Why wouldn't it be right?" It's ticking into dangerous territory, by the way he's begun once more muting any obvious emotional response. It wouldn't stop him from feeling it, but it would hide the obvious weakness. "Shooting me is acceptable, but keeping me alive isn't? Turning a WEAPON on me is something you're willing to consider, but not an influence I not only consented to but requested?"
It sounds like it's merely a puzzled question, and there's no way to be sure if it is just confusion or if something uglier undercurrents it just by looking at Sephiroth.
But there's a slow lash of the long black tentacle between the guard hound's stiff shoulders, back and forth like a pendulum, and a deep, reverberating gutteral snarl at Vincent's final question as Sephiroth jerks himself back to his feet in one too-fast motion.
"If you don't actually want to help then just say so and stop playing with me. This isn't a game." The calming, euphoric effects of this stretch of river only go so far against the volatile temperament of a teenager as he turns on one booted heel and stalks away - not closer to Exile at least.
More slowly Vincent rises, but rise he does to stand up and stride to follow. He has quite an advantage there with long legs. Sephiroth still needs quite a few years.
"Sephiroth. I'm trying to help you!" He might not be directly behind the boy but the former Turk's voice is clear and holds enough emphasis to suggest the commanding exclamation. "I'm asking because it's not a game. Whatever happened during that Trial... what do you think will happen when you go back home and try to kill Hojo?"
He'll stop if the teen stops. But he can't afford to let Sephiroth too get too far away.
In a year and a half he'll be taller than Vincent, though it might take longer to outweigh him. Right now though.. he's still on the small side for his age, and though if he really wanted to he could move terrifyingly quickly, he isn't doing so. Not yet.
Casimir is an obvious warning of how rigidly he does control his reactions though, for all that white fangs are bared, ears pinned back in a picture of aggressive hostility, Sephiroth has not physically lashed out.
Lesser things break when he loses his temper like that. "You're not, you're just ... trying for some moral high ground so you can throw up your hands and say you tried. Everything you offer in one hand comes with a knife in the other! I can't even accept what you offer without you snatching it away! Do that enough to a monster and they tend to bite."
"If it's really what you want, I will do it. However you want." While his voice is quiet, it still carries. While he had never said he wouldn't, he doesn't make a point of this aloud.
It would do no good.
"No tricks. No test. That wasn't what I intended to suggest."
It doesn't mollify him. Not under the weight of the stressor that had been pushing his comfort on going to Exile, on deliberately intending to spread his cells like an infection for the purpose of practicing something he was sure was bad.. then explaining even shallowly Otherworld's effects. Then losing his cat to the trickery of Familiar shapeshifting and the embarrassment of knowing so much he preferred to keep hidden was well known. He was an incredibly private kid as it was, having that violated..
.. and letting someone inside his head.. suddenly didn't seem like such a good idea.
It sounds like Vincent's after martyrdom, or some false mirror of it to try to look good while doing nothing. Something Vincent could add to his 'list of sins' to feel bad about, and tied directly to each others emotions, Sephiroth would be constantly aware of it.
There is a bitter, wounded part of him that's sure suddenly this is the entire point. When he stops and turns, there's a calculating frost to his bearing, everything by degrees ratcheted down, boxed up and buried again. His control might break, but inevitably he'd reclaim it.
There's no doubt at all he's nowhere as calm as he seems. Not a word is said. Not yet.
Vincent is under no false impression that his words have had a positive impact. No hope that he hadn't screwed up in a bad way.
If Sephiroth took that opportunity to repudiate him and seek to prevent further contact, it would not be a surprise. One that, though it could be mistaken for a slow blink, causes his eyes to close for a bit longer. They'll open again, filled with the emotion of a man bracing for the worst.
Would this change his intention to continue trying to help the teen? No. But it seems clear at this stage, in that moment, that Vincent's own foolishness has caused an irreparable rift to form. There is no form of apology that would even help... or not sound at the minimum hollow.
And no words that should be spoken at all, thus the silence stretches on to wait for Sephiroth to collect himself and be the first to address him. It will not matter how long this takes. Vincent will not add try to speak in his defense or espouse earnest explanations.
They would. Anything to save face, to remain The Adult, who thus Knows Better, as so many others have his whole life.
There were lessons to be had in Folkmore, ones echoed in his time in Hojo's lab. Emotion .. really was a weakness, and he needed to stop pretending he was anything but what he was, a weapon and a monster. Trying for anything else ended badly, even something as simple as a pet.
If he couldn't trust Vincent's offers, then the reassurance that he'd be put first was obviously also a deception. So be it.
"Say again what a Familiar Bond requires. What it does. What it does not."
"To form a Familiar Bond, the Familiar and the Legend or Myth must both agree to it," Vincent begins. His voice is neutral; his mind drawing every piece of information he had said originally and making sure he had not missed something that he had learned.
His tone remains steady, stating only fact.
"A psychic connection is formed. I've been told it allows us to know where the other is. It can be used to lessen the impact of amplified emotions Legends and Myths experience. A bond would let us know the emotions and condition of the other."
There is a short pause while he considers what it does not do.
"...The Bond seems to only be mental. At least there is no sharing of physical ability. Nothing I've heard suggests we would be vulnerable to each others emotions. But given the nature of it, I wouldn't rely on that."
Vincent seems to be finished, going as far as to offer a conclusion.
"It's based on the pair's desire to make a bond that will aid the Legend or Myth in their goals and needs. This may shape it in ways I haven't learned about. And..." a pause. "...the strength of it will probably be affected by trust."
Trust, something rather damaged this last hour. Singly, any of these things would have been surmountable with little effort. Together..
"Very well, I agree to it."
He had goals he would pursue whether or not anything got in his way. If this was just to manipulate him, or play games with his trust and his future, then he would be strong enough to overcome it. He had to be.
Surprise. Not entirely hidden if the slightest widening of Vincent's gaze and the stillness is anything to consider proof. But the hesitation doesn't last any longer longer than a blink of an eye; the gunman is aware of he does so, he will lose Sephiroth completely.
"Then, I agree to be your Familiar, Sephiroth."
Words were needed, but it's as simple as that. Instincts bestowed on the former Turk guide the Fox-bestowed ability to reach out along the signal of intent and wish, weaving threads of a connection with far more conviction than either man would probably expect.
The bond doesn't hesitate. All it needed was to be wished for and accepted, no more or less.
Surprise, remorse. Concern. Elements of feelings toward Sephiroth. Shame... guilt. In Vincent himself. These might be the first things which drift across the connection as it is formed.
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momijizukamori
no subject
Date: 2024-09-15 10:05 pm (UTC)Moving on though is a mixed blessing. Again the former Turk shakes his head before explaining. "Chaos merging with me was an unintended side-effect... consequence of what was done to make sure I survived." Or so it was mentioned in notes found, for all she expressed her sorrow and apologized so, so many times in visions, dreams and nightmares. Though that's not all she was apologizing for.
Nothing worked out the way it was intended.
"She used a... naturally occurring element, something created by the Lifestream like mako or materia. Dark and chaotic in nature, it is... what Chaos was born from." There is a short pause. "...It was used in the birth of Nero the Sable, too."
Yet another shake of his head. "I've only been able to piece together what was done to me from data I found. And traces Lucrecia left behind as messages. Hojo was probably right when he claimed his experiments made my body unable to age or die. The mention of degeneration..." Vincent shrugs. How that fits in with 'not aging or dying' is certainly unclear. Those details are vague.
"...I wasn't always conscious during the procedures or in between. But... probably because of that, I was able to hold on. Whatever Lucrecia did in the end before she disappeared stabilized me. But opened the way for Chaos."
Sephiroth probably understands very well why Vincent is glossing over the details he does remember of the procedures. 'Not always conscious' does mean there were times he was and probably felt every bit of the disorientation and pain already implied.
no subject
Date: 2024-09-15 10:42 pm (UTC)This doesn't make the rest of it irrelevant. He knows what being under the care of Hojo meant, as profoundly as any of the other victims could. The only difference was Hojo's vested interest in seeing him survive, so there was always a plethora of medical equipment and healing materia onhand to make certain if his unnatural regeneration failed that he still wouldn't die, a luxury not afforded the rest of the samples.
Not remembering all of it was a mercy.
no subject
Date: 2024-09-15 10:59 pm (UTC)Just that... the way was opened for Vincent to host it.
"There's also what Hojo did. While he didn't succeed in what his goal was, it still left me with a durable body. The... element, the chaos energy is still present. But Chaos itself wasn't needed to sustain me. And if there's more to it than that... I don't know."
What he does know is that he did a swan dive into Omega, Chaos and Omega returned to the Planet and he... well, he emerged whole again.
Now, Vincent does look a little uncomfortable. It's been tricky to talk about, trickier still to be confronted with the holes in what he still doesn't know about everything that's been done to him. Sure he's discovered little by little, sometimes at the cost of a lot of pain. But it seems like a drop in the bucket in the face of Sephiroth's probing questions.
"Sorry."
no subject
Date: 2024-09-16 09:45 pm (UTC)"It doesn't matter." Idle curiosity, and little else. "Is a WEAPON capable of killing me in a permanent fashion? I don't recall anyone mentioning they were effective."
no subject
Date: 2024-09-16 11:51 pm (UTC)It didn't matter if it was Sephiroth's actions that had summoned them forth.
"Chaos was designed to destroy all life and return it to the Lifestream," Vincent responds after a short pause. "If there was a weapon that could kill Sephiroth permanently, it would be the most likely to succeed. But there's no way to be sure."
Without... well, killing Sephiroth outside of Folkmore.
no subject
Date: 2024-09-17 12:39 am (UTC)Chaos and Omega, it seemed, were tangents. "I'm sure if it became necessary, people would line up for the chance to subdue a violent and dangerous opponent. Perhaps even Thirteen herself." What did he want out of a bond?
Nothing it could offer. He didn't need a friendly hand, he needed a leash and a muzzle.
When the guard hound makes a reappearance in a slow roil of black smoke, it's close enough to settle at Sephiroth's side, not..quite touching.
"If.. if I go mad here. If I fully become a monster." His gaze turns towards the river, and its glittering banks. "Find out why. Use this link for that. Was it inevitable? Or was I pushed? And if it was forced." Maybe it was inevitable and nothing could be done. Maybe it was his fate all along.
But if not. "A Familiar bond will let you find me. What I want, Mr. Valentine." Only then does he actually look at the red clad Turk, somber. "Is for you to bring me the ones who wronged me. And then leave them to face what they made. No matter who it is."
no subject
Date: 2024-09-17 01:35 am (UTC)Does Sephiroth's power rival a direct shot from either versions of the canon? Could he endure a shot similar to the strength of Sister Ray? ...Let's hope they never have to really find that out. Neither Chaos or Omega alone had any more intelligence than those WEAPONS. It had been their connection and embodiment with the wills of Vincent Valentine and then Weiss and Nero, that had given them any sentience that would be recognized as such. And that probably made the Chaos slumbering in the Vincent of his world a threat. At least, an unknown.
Now that the teen knows, it's no doubt he'll remember if things go wrong. But that is a problem for the future that they're hoping, on some level, to prevent.
What do you want from the bond. Though Vincent had been glancing out at the river, when Sephiroth again finally brings up the potential for future madness, he turns his entire focus on the silver haired youth. The request is not entirely met with surprise. Yet there's a brief hesitation, to think over what those words would mean. Vincent is far from reluctant. However there are a great many factors to consider. Finding the truth of that madness and there are plenty of elements in Folkmore alien to their world that could trigger it.
"I will do everything I can to find out why." Through the bond, though all his skills as a former Turk. And whatever help he can gather from others. There's then a slow nod, though he offers a quiet question.
"If Thirteen is the case. Or if she brings Lucrecia here... Gast or Hojo." Well at least two of those Vincent would have no problem throwing to the silver wolf god. The third.... "Should I bring them as well?"
And... well, if he's bringing them, he'll already be there won't he?
no subject
Date: 2024-09-17 01:48 am (UTC)He was very focused in that particular wish for retaliation. If someone went out of their way to provoke it.. "I don't get the impression even trying to destroy the world that I become any less intelligent, or truly feral. But positive punishment may be an effective deterrent even if I am aware it's what's happening, to at least prevent rampant havoc." Emotional influence could be a powerful thing. If he found pleasure in the kill, souring that joy would make it less appealing.
no subject
Date: 2024-09-17 02:23 am (UTC)"Not that I'm aware." Frankly, Vincent wasn't sure if the arrogance had changed. What Sephiroth had been brought up believing... seeing out of those around him compared to his own power... "I can't make any promises that I'd succeed if it turned out to be Thirteen in the end. But that wouldn't stop me from trying. Anyone else... I'll manage somehow."
The former Turk's eyes are now opened fully. He's studying Sephiroth carefully as he remarks about the use of emotional manipulations. "That.... you want me to use the bond to manipulate your reaction to certain actions?" The question is probably as neutrally spoken as Vincent can manage and yet it's still clear he's not comfortable with the idea.
"That... did Hojo... the scientists, use that on you? That how you learned it?" Very clear.
no subject
Date: 2024-09-17 02:35 am (UTC)"You won't be able to manage direct control, like I can my eventual puppets. That wouldn't be 'supporting a legend', and presumably is beyond the reach of such a tether." Messing with his emotions was not ideal but could be used to try to curb the worst.
Would he even take pleasure in slaughtering people without any chance of fighting him? Or was it merely the satisfaction an exterminator feels on eradicating a nest of vermin?
The idea that Hojo or the others COULD do such a thing to him earns a blank look. "No, of course not." They did, but through different means than what he's intending here. Enough reinforcement for what they wanted, and he no longer resisted. He hadn't needed to be bound to a table since he was young, no matter what they did. "It's standard procedure for unruly specimens when positive reinforcement fails. I've watched it countless times. SOme species simply don't react to anything else."
no subject
Date: 2024-09-17 02:31 pm (UTC)It also hurts because Vincent knows he's probably capable of setting aside the morals and doing it.
"I'm not thrilled that you're asking me to do something that even the scientists at the company or Hojo might not have done," Vincent finally begins. There's a trace of bitterness; but he could be forgiven for not liking it in that context. As to the way the teen devalues his worth as a person and simply implies Vincent should just regard it as standard procedure for an unruly specimen. But he won't bring that up now.
"But... explain further how you want it used. I don't want anything to hinder what you have to do when you return to your time." So far, Sephiroth has only generalized. So the former Turk can't really be blamed for wanting specifics under those conditions.
Right?
no subject
Date: 2024-09-17 04:58 pm (UTC)Dog and boy share a brief look. "You ... offered to do just that a few minutes ago." His tone is slow and cautious, unsure suddenly what the right answer is supposed to be. Was he supposed to interpret the mention of Familiars calming Legend emotions, and exerting influence over them, in some other way?
Was he supposed to refuse, and be insulted at its implication? "Was this a test?" He must have failed it.
no subject
Date: 2024-09-17 06:30 pm (UTC)"Damn it." ...What? While Vincent doesn't quite drag his hand down his face - for obvious reasons- it's slowly pulled downward and away to drop to his knees again. He exhales to steady himself and turns to face the pair.
"I did. But this wasn't a test. What you just said makes me realize it was no better than how the scientists treated you your entire life." His expression shows muted regret and resignation; probably going a lot deeper.
"Worse, because I know you accept so many things without question because of that abuse. Even if it sounds reasonable, the rational thing to do."
no subject
Date: 2024-09-17 06:50 pm (UTC)"...It is the reasonable thing to do, or you wouldn't have suggested it to begin with." How much of the objection he really understands is questionable.
But he does know an offer was made, and it was sensible at the time. Still was, even after a review of it. "If it was ... some form of abuse, which I question, a tool is a tool, no matter who's using it before you do. You can't tame a monster with friendship and love." They can however be occasionally beaten into submission!
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Date: 2024-09-17 11:22 pm (UTC)Probably, since it was balancing out something that was being forced on Sephiroth. But it had opened a door.
"The part that wasn't right, no matter how it sounds, was to suggest it be used for anything else. To control your emotions or your actions based on those emotions. You've been conditioned to believe that. To think it's normal."
Though... it's true Vincent is unclear if even that would be something that gets through to the teen. So... he proffers a question.
"...If you don't believe me, then... when you were experiencing the Trial in the fog, what stopped you from helping Hojo's victim?
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Date: 2024-09-17 11:55 pm (UTC)It sounds like it's merely a puzzled question, and there's no way to be sure if it is just confusion or if something uglier undercurrents it just by looking at Sephiroth.
But there's a slow lash of the long black tentacle between the guard hound's stiff shoulders, back and forth like a pendulum, and a deep, reverberating gutteral snarl at Vincent's final question as Sephiroth jerks himself back to his feet in one too-fast motion.
"If you don't actually want to help then just say so and stop playing with me. This isn't a game." The calming, euphoric effects of this stretch of river only go so far against the volatile temperament of a teenager as he turns on one booted heel and stalks away - not closer to Exile at least.
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Date: 2024-09-18 12:16 am (UTC)"Sephiroth. I'm trying to help you!" He might not be directly behind the boy but the former Turk's voice is clear and holds enough emphasis to suggest the commanding exclamation. "I'm asking because it's not a game. Whatever happened during that Trial... what do you think will happen when you go back home and try to kill Hojo?"
He'll stop if the teen stops. But he can't afford to let Sephiroth too get too far away.
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Date: 2024-09-18 12:34 am (UTC)Casimir is an obvious warning of how rigidly he does control his reactions though, for all that white fangs are bared, ears pinned back in a picture of aggressive hostility, Sephiroth has not physically lashed out.
Lesser things break when he loses his temper like that. "You're not, you're just ... trying for some moral high ground so you can throw up your hands and say you tried. Everything you offer in one hand comes with a knife in the other! I can't even accept what you offer without you snatching it away! Do that enough to a monster and they tend to bite."
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Date: 2024-09-18 01:32 am (UTC)It would do no good.
"No tricks. No test. That wasn't what I intended to suggest."
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Date: 2024-09-18 07:40 pm (UTC).. and letting someone inside his head.. suddenly didn't seem like such a good idea.
It sounds like Vincent's after martyrdom, or some false mirror of it to try to look good while doing nothing. Something Vincent could add to his 'list of sins' to feel bad about, and tied directly to each others emotions, Sephiroth would be constantly aware of it.
There is a bitter, wounded part of him that's sure suddenly this is the entire point. When he stops and turns, there's a calculating frost to his bearing, everything by degrees ratcheted down, boxed up and buried again. His control might break, but inevitably he'd reclaim it.
There's no doubt at all he's nowhere as calm as he seems. Not a word is said. Not yet.
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Date: 2024-09-18 08:35 pm (UTC)If Sephiroth took that opportunity to repudiate him and seek to prevent further contact, it would not be a surprise. One that, though it could be mistaken for a slow blink, causes his eyes to close for a bit longer. They'll open again, filled with the emotion of a man bracing for the worst.
Would this change his intention to continue trying to help the teen? No. But it seems clear at this stage, in that moment, that Vincent's own foolishness has caused an irreparable rift to form. There is no form of apology that would even help... or not sound at the minimum hollow.
And no words that should be spoken at all, thus the silence stretches on to wait for Sephiroth to collect himself and be the first to address him. It will not matter how long this takes. Vincent will not add try to speak in his defense or espouse earnest explanations.
Wouldn't they just come across as excuses?
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Date: 2024-09-18 09:07 pm (UTC)There were lessons to be had in Folkmore, ones echoed in his time in Hojo's lab. Emotion .. really was a weakness, and he needed to stop pretending he was anything but what he was, a weapon and a monster. Trying for anything else ended badly, even something as simple as a pet.
If he couldn't trust Vincent's offers, then the reassurance that he'd be put first was obviously also a deception. So be it.
"Say again what a Familiar Bond requires. What it does. What it does not."
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Date: 2024-09-18 10:53 pm (UTC)His tone remains steady, stating only fact.
"A psychic connection is formed. I've been told it allows us to know where the other is. It can be used to lessen the impact of amplified emotions Legends and Myths experience. A bond would let us know the emotions and condition of the other."
There is a short pause while he considers what it does not do.
"...The Bond seems to only be mental. At least there is no sharing of physical ability. Nothing I've heard suggests we would be vulnerable to each others emotions. But given the nature of it, I wouldn't rely on that."
Vincent seems to be finished, going as far as to offer a conclusion.
"It's based on the pair's desire to make a bond that will aid the Legend or Myth in their goals and needs. This may shape it in ways I haven't learned about. And..." a pause. "...the strength of it will probably be affected by trust."
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Date: 2024-09-19 12:32 am (UTC)"Very well, I agree to it."
He had goals he would pursue whether or not anything got in his way. If this was just to manipulate him, or play games with his trust and his future, then he would be strong enough to overcome it. He had to be.
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Date: 2024-09-19 12:47 am (UTC)"Then, I agree to be your Familiar, Sephiroth."
Words were needed, but it's as simple as that. Instincts bestowed on the former Turk guide the Fox-bestowed ability to reach out along the signal of intent and wish, weaving threads of a connection with far more conviction than either man would probably expect.
The bond doesn't hesitate. All it needed was to be wished for and accepted, no more or less.
Surprise, remorse. Concern. Elements of feelings toward Sephiroth. Shame... guilt. In Vincent himself. These might be the first things which drift across the connection as it is formed.
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